FOSS gamedev and creative worlds

ok, so i see that some modders compress their mods in .rar or .7z...
but i was thinking, that maybe there should be atleast 1 .zip file...
because maybe some users are used to use mods without downloading something they will only need because theres 1 mod that requires it.
not saying that there shouldnt be any .7z or .rar compressed mods, but just include atleast 1 .zip mod in your mod topic.
it would save more time for the users, and make it easier for them as well.

It would be a good idea to always use .zip, because Windows only natively supports .zip. On the other hand, .tar.gz is the most widely supported on Linux; my installation didn't come with .zip.

I'd say it's probably easier to install .zip/.rar/.7z support on Linux (via package management) than it is to hunt down and download a .rar/.7z/.tar.gz program for Windows.

Yeah, go with .tar.gz or .zip.

I ignore plugins that only have .7z or .rar downloads available.

If anyone who uses these formats is reading this, I'm building a mining plugin right now, and trying to support as many ores as I can. At least two ore plugins are in formats I can't extract, and they WILL NOT GET SUPPORT in mine if they aren't re-uploaded in a better format by the time I'm ready to add said support. I will not request an alternate download specifically, I'll just skip these plugins, so you're on your own if you want support.

Is that difficult to download 7zip archiever grom 7-z.org? Don't underestimate windows users - they were searhing for cracks and keys for a VERY long time, so that's not a problem to get 7z and open almoust ANY type of compressed file. It seems you havent seen even 1 hundred of beginner users of the internet. The way they're searhing is far more complicated then typing "7z download" at google.com.
Well, there ARE some retarded users, but what on Earth that kind of people will be doing here? We all are more like testers or developers then players.
Also don't be ridiculos. You can't seriosly think that a phrase "I will ignore your mods unless they are in zip or tar.gz" would change anything. C'mon the one who will suffer would be no other than you. There are hundreds of people who will use those "ignored-by-you" mods. You're not some mega corporation to have a right to ignore anything and wait for others to follow you.
You can't ignore good/popular mods in ANY format, even if you were talking about some private server. Well, unless you want to shrink the number of players on your server.

Many people come to linux and opensource for freedom, do not forget that either and do not tell them what to do.
As allways - do NOT get offended ;)

Please stick with .zip, Those who don't like installing software (like me) do not like to have to install 7-zip everytime we have to download a .7z file

ZIP files are more standard on all platforms. I also ignore mods that link to archives other than ZIP.
On a similar topic, I ignore mods that are hosted on sites that require registration. Also, I ignore files hosted on mediafire or similar sites. Why can't you use ompldr or dropbox?

mediafire is fine for me, but I will change my mods to dropbox eventually

Any mods i make in the future i will zip, personally i am used to rar but thats just me. Rar will extract almost everything i need and to be honest i didnt realize so few people used it, i take it there is no rar programs for linux users? Anyway reason i changed from zip to rar is because when rar was new it was used everywhere on the internet for downloads. I used to use zip but at that stage winzip couldnt extract rar files but rar could extract both, hence why i changed. Nowadays both rar and zip extract either, in the future i will make sure any mods i produce are in zip format.

Traxie21 wrote:Please stick with .zip, Those who don't like installing software (like me) do not like to have to install 7-zip everytime we have to download a .7z file

Everytime? Are you serious? Do you really uninstall archiver after every unpack procedure?

Dopium wrote: i take it there is no rar programs for linux users?

There IS unpacking tool for rar archives which comes with 7z or can be installed separately. One even has no need to use some terminal emulator, 'cause there are several available GUIs for different DEs, like "file roller" etc.

Note: I'm NOT against zip, but guys, your reasons/arguments are somewhat lame.

4aiman wrote:Note: I'm NOT against zip, but guys, your reasons/arguments are somewhat lame.

Thanks! Your reasons/arguments to use 7z are lame too.

The .rar format is non-free and uses lossy compression which is totally useless for Minetest mods (tell me the name of a mod whose size is > 10MB), so why not use .zip, a free format which is supported on all OSes natively?

kaeza wrote:

4aiman wrote:Note: I'm NOT against zip, but guys, your reasons/arguments are somewhat lame.

Thanks! Your reasons/arguments to use RAR are lame too.

When did I say to use rar? O_o

Calinou wrote:The .rar format is non-free and uses lossy compression which is totally useless for Minetest mods (tell me the name of a mod whose size is > 10MB), so why not use .zip, a free format which is supported on all OSes natively?

Did you hear about not having zip support on some distro? (by Menche)
So why linux users must install smth if windows users mustn't? It wasn't my idea to "not having to download anything to unpack a mod"

4aiman wrote:

kaeza wrote:

4aiman wrote:Note: I'm NOT against zip, but guys, your reasons/arguments are somewhat lame.

Thanks! Your reasons/arguments to use RAR are lame too.

When did I say to use rar? O_o

Let's not turn this thread into an archive format war please.
And I meant to say 7z, but you didn't leave me time to edit the post.

kaeza wrote:And I meant to say 7z, but you didn't leave me time to edit the post.

And when did i say to use 7z?
All I said is that there ARE 7z archivers under any OS. Not native, but 7z compresses way better than zip.

4aiman wrote:

kaeza wrote:And I meant to say 7z, but you didn't leave me time to edit the post.

And when did i say to use 7z?

Just forget it okay? Did you take the time to read my *other* statement?
EDIT: typo

kaeza wrote:

4aiman wrote:

kaeza wrote:And I meant to say 7z, but you didn't leave me time to edit the post.

And when did i say to use 7z?

Just forget it okay? Did you take the time to read my statement?

Of course. But there's no need to turn my words upside-down.
Consider that forgotten unless someone would repeat I'm for 7z only ;)

1 format isn't good at all. There always will be some complaints, so maybe other that making only 1 format it would be wise to attach 2-3 formats and most people would be happy?

4aiman wrote:1 format isn't good at all. There always will be some complaints, so maybe other that making only 1 format it would be wise to attach 2-3 formats and most people would be happy?

Agreed. Maybe a ZIP format for "standard" and a 7z/rar format for "small file size".

Yep, something like that. In fact this was very often used in the days of wap 2.0 popularity. One goes to some site and under download section of almost any program for J2ME there were several links: *.jar, *.jad, *.zip, *.rar.
People should have a right to choose :)
Besides "zip" is used by the GitHub and many mods are hosted there. And some people want to use the "latest" stuff so they definitely would go there and grab a zip.
So for "standard" - yes, but there has to be some other download links.
I'm not saying that all modders should add different download links for their mods, but no one should "ignore" some mods because of archive format.
To not repeat one's plea is to be rude to others. A simple post like "I can't use zip, please, could you make a link to *.* format?" should be considered as advice by modder, if he/she doesn't have a link to that format already. If there is one - there can be many as well. We all want to make Minetest better, so one more request of additional format in some topic about some mod is a natural thing to do. Unless this "zip" + smth else/only zip thing isn't in the rules of the forum.

Maybe this type of matter should be discussed by everyone? I mean, If there would be HUGE note about the poll and that EVERY user must decide: "zip", "zip as 'standard' +smth else" or "no standards at all", and that no one will be able to post more than 1 post a day if he/she had not voted. Some kind of elections.
(I know, I've gone too far from the reality, but that how things like this should be "voted")

7zip for windows is easy. http://7zip.org

IMO the 7zip archiver is better than any other for windows.

Getting 7zip support on most linux distros is also trivial.

Simply put tar.gz/tar.bz2 are most supported on linux and zip most supported on windows. However sometimes zip isn't supported on linux.

IF there were simple ways to pack mods (hint scripts) this would be a non issue. Pack a zip pack a 7z pack a tar.gz and be done with it. Of course I bet this won't happen.

4aiman wrote:Is that difficult to download 7zip archiever grom 7-z.org? Don't underestimate windows users - they were searhing for cracks and keys for a VERY long time, so that's not a problem to get 7z and open almoust ANY type of compressed file. It seems you havent seen even 1 hundred of beginner users of the internet. The way they're searhing is far more complicated then typing "7z download" at google.com.
Well, there ARE some retarded users, but what on Earth that kind of people will be doing here? We all are more like testers or developers then players.
Also don't be ridiculos. You can't seriosly think that a phrase "I will ignore your mods unless they are in zip or tar.gz" would change anything. C'mon the one who will suffer would be no other than you. There are hundreds of people who will use those "ignored-by-you" mods. You're not some mega corporation to have a right to ignore anything and wait for others to follow you.
You can't ignore good/popular mods in ANY format, even if you were talking about some private server. Well, unless you want to shrink the number of players on your server.

Many people come to linux and opensource for freedom, do not forget that either and do not tell them what to do.
As allways - do NOT get offended ;)

First, it's not about ease, it's about not wanting to install unnecessary software on my computer. I'm not installing 7Zip just because some people would rather upload files in that format than something more accessible.

Second, the format files are uploaded in has no effect on my server. The appeal of my server is it's mostly vanilla set-up. While I think plugins are great, I keep mine mostly-vanilla because it's hard to find a server that is mostly vanilla, so mine is nice when you want to play a simple game.

Third, I'm not the one who suffers. In fact, it makes my job easier, because I have less plugins to write support for. Most of the time, the plugins I would want to add (aside from all the beautiful block-adders, as I can't draw) do such simple things, that I'd rather just write them myself, to have better control over how they work.

Fourth, Some people have strong opinions. These people will not be swayed by my statements. I know that. But others don't realize that ".7z"s and ".rar"s are a hassle for some people. Between that and the fact that some people such as myself won't provide compatibility support, maybe my statement will change a couple people's way of compressing files. It's no guarantee, but it doesn't hurt for me to try.

Calinou wrote:The .rar format is non-free and uses lossy compression which is totally useless for Minetest mods (tell me the name of a mod whose size is > 10MB), so why not use .zip, a free format which is supported on all OSes natively?

Lossy compression? I did not know that. I really don't like lossy compression. That's why I won't save anything as a .jpeg (although I do accept images in .jpeg format, as I don't need special software to open them).

I have only tar.gz suport on my OS... and I dont want to install Zip suport !

Here goes +1 for "I don't want" ;)
I seriously doubt that those who dislike 7z or tar.gz or tar.bz or rar (lossy? prooflink to the stage!) or any other format will never have to deal with those formats. But lets suppose they wouldn't. Then I have a question for those who do not want to download just ONE tool (yep, I'm about 7z, which can unpack most of the formats) which would take their cares away. Why do you want to download a package manager "just because some people would rather upload files" to it's repo? ;)
A contradiction? Well, human mind can deal with those very easy.
Besides, those who DO download, will use zip with a very high probability. Why? 'Cause manager is on the GitHub which can make a zip-ball. Repo is good but there would be hundreds of users who will download that zip and extract only the manager file. As well as those who will do it only in spite of their poor connection. But that's not a matter. You can even do not answer on my first question and consider that rhetorical.

But think on these: If one want to download this manager, then why it can't depend on zip or 7z or rar or tar or gz or any other package? People install different useless packages which comes with smplayer or qutim or kolourpaint4 in Gnome while others install some gnome things in xfce or even lxde (never have heard about KDE user installing smth from Gnome), but here we have a discussion about useful package and yet many people refuse to download additional tool. You already HAVE TO download smth. 1 or 2 files - that's not important.

Summary: Make a rpm and deb packages with the dependency on some compressing library. That's ridiculous to want png not to use zlib and that's ridiculous to complain that mod manager will depend on some libs.

Zip, rar, cab, arj, 7z, whatever. I'm cool with anything. I have 7-zip File Manager. MUHAHAHAHA!

rinoux wrote:I have only tar.gz suport on my OS... and I dont want to install Zip suport !

Why?

Calinou wrote:

rinoux wrote:I have only tar.gz suport on my OS... and I dont want to install Zip suport !

Why?

May be he found minetest mods repo of no use? Considering this place that's the only reasonable reason %)

kaeza wrote:

4aiman wrote:Note: I'm NOT against zip, but guys, your reasons/arguments are somewhat lame.

Thanks! Your reasons/arguments to use 7z are lame too.

+1

Install 7-zip. Its free, better than normal zip program, allows you to open many formats, its free.

There definitely are 7-zip haters. My reasons are lame too. Huh.
Well, if my point of "what the hell you are arguin' about?!!" is lame, then +1 meant that it's placer do not read me well. Also that +1 meant that original posts WERE lame too - because of "too" ;p

You know what? Until all people here would realize that there is one easy 7zip package to rule hem all, this topic is something that should be ignored. You doesn't even realize that you're saying people "Well, f**k you! there would be smth that you do not appreciate with only 2 ways out: get used or get lost!"
It would be NICER if you've said that straight instead of +anything on posts like that. Just continue to listening to those who have nothing unnecessary on their OS or do not like to install smth. Do not like to install? DELETE this game, 'cause Minetest is a program too. One may even delete his/her OS, 'cause that's too a "complex program".
I'm outta this thread where some ignorant people doesn't want to hear reason. ;p