Mapgen Settings Question(s)

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Neon
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Mapgen Settings Question(s)

by Neon » Wed Oct 09, 2013 08:27

What sort of server-side settings would I need to make biomes larger and to make gentler slopes? In effect, I'm looking for mapgen settings that would make the world seem larger (because hills tend to be broader and biomes larger)
 

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rubenwardy
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by rubenwardy » Wed Oct 09, 2013 08:37

All the map generation settings are here: https://github.com/minetest/minetest/blob/master/minetest.conf.example#L338

These may interest you:

Your phone or window isn't wide enough to display the code box. If it's a phone, try rotating it to landscape mode.
Code: Select all
# Offset, scale, spread factor, seed offset, number of octaves, persistence
#mgv6_np_terrain_base = -4, 20, (250, 250, 250), 82341, 5, 0.6
#mgv6_np_terrain_higher = 20, 16, (500, 500, 500), 85039, 5, 0.6
#mgv6_np_steepness = 0.85, 0.5, (125, 125, 125), -932, 5, 0.7
#mgv6_np_height_select = 0.5, 1, (250, 250, 250), 4213, 5, 0.69
#mgv6_np_mud = 4, 2, (200, 200, 200), 91013, 3, 0.55
#mgv6_np_beach = 0, 1, (250, 250, 250), 59420, 3, 0.50
#mgv6_np_biome = 0, 1, (250, 250, 250), 9130, 3, 0.50
#mgv6_np_cave = 6, 6, (250, 250, 250), 34329, 3, 0.50
#mgv6_np_humidity = 0.5, 0.5, (500, 500, 500), 72384, 4, 0.66
#mgv6_np_trees = 0, 1, (125, 125, 125), 2, 4, 0.66
#mgv6_np_apple_trees = 0, 1, (100, 100, 100), 342902, 3, 0.45


There are more settings
Last edited by rubenwardy on Wed Oct 09, 2013 08:38, edited 1 time in total.
 

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by Wuzzy » Wed Oct 09, 2013 15:20

rubenwardy wrote:
Your phone or window isn't wide enough to display the code box. If it's a phone, try rotating it to landscape mode.
Code: Select all
# Offset, scale, spread factor, seed offset, number of octaves, persistence


I guess many non-programmers here do not know what these words mean.
What do these words mean?

I would like to include the information on the Wiki. :-)
I'm creating MineClone 2, a Minecraft clone for Minetest.
I made the Help modpack, adding in-game help to Minetest.
 

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by PilzAdam » Wed Oct 09, 2013 15:30

Wuzzy wrote:
rubenwardy wrote:
Your phone or window isn't wide enough to display the code box. If it's a phone, try rotating it to landscape mode.
Code: Select all
# Offset, scale, spread factor, seed offset, number of octaves, persistence


I guess many non-programmers here do not know what these words mean.
What do these words mean?

I would like to include the information on the Wiki. :-)

Its not programming specific stuff, its used in perlin noise.
 

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by twoelk » Wed Oct 09, 2013 16:20

I'd love to have a minetest wiki article on this subject to my aid.

Something easier to understand than this:
http://freespace.virgin.net/hugo.elias/models/m_perlin.htm
and this:
http://webstaff.itn.liu.se/~stegu/TNM022-2005/perlinnoiselinks/

I thought I had a pretty sure idea of what an octave was before I read the perlin stuff, now I know the word is used for things I don't get the scope of yet and surely have nothing to do with music. -- And as a warning setting the "number of octaves" value to high can crash the program.

The problem still is, one might know what perlin noise is but still not understand which value has what effect in a minetest world.

I am really looking forward to an easy to understand Wiki article on this subject.
 

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by paramat » Wed Oct 09, 2013 17:15

#mgv6_np_biome = 0, 1, (250, 250, 250), 9130, 3, 0.50
The 'spread factor' is the 3 numbers in brackets.
Those numbers are in nodes (or metres) and very roughly define the maximum scale of that perlin structure.
So the spread factor of the biome perlin noise is very roughly the maximum size in nodes of the biomes.
To make biomes twice as big try (500, 500, 500).
There are 3 numbers to enable setting the maximum structure scale independantly for x y and z. So you could create biomes stretched in the z direction by using (250, 250, 500).
See Casimir's nodetest game for perlin parameters that create larger biomes and larger scale terrain.
Last edited by paramat on Wed Oct 09, 2013 17:18, edited 1 time in total.
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by Casimir » Wed Oct 09, 2013 17:40

I'll give it a try. Might be wrong in some points.

offset
(?) I have no idea.

scale
(?) Scale is used to define both amplitude (and frequency). Bigger scale leads to higher mountains.

spread factor
See the post by paramat.

seed offset
The seed wont change the look of the output. It is used to create different noises with the same settings. Same seed for forests and mountains would cause forest always be on top of mountains.

number of octaves
More octaves means more details and more calculation.

persistence
Persistence defines how strong the details are visible, it does not add more of them. A low persistence will cause the terrain to be smooth, a high (max 1) causes strong ups and downs.
Last edited by Casimir on Wed Oct 09, 2013 17:45, edited 1 time in total.
 

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by jojoa1997 » Wed Oct 09, 2013 17:41

paramat wrote:#mgv6_np_biome = 0, 1, (250, 250, 250), 9130, 3, 0.50
The 'spread factor' is the 3 numbers in brackets.
Those numbers are in nodes (or metres) and very roughly define the maximum scale of that perlin structure.
So the spread factor of the biome perlin noise is very roughly the maximum size in nodes of the biomes.
To make biomes twice as big try (500, 500, 500).
There are 3 numbers to enable setting the maximum structure scale independantly for x y and z. So you could create biomes stretched in the z direction by using (250, 250, 500).
See Casimir's nodetest game for perlin parameters that create larger biomes and larger scale terrain.
the mapgen king is here
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by paramat » Wed Oct 09, 2013 19:08

Offset and scale should be left alone unless you know what you are doing, these define the average value and amplitude of the noise value output.
0, 1 is standard and matches the older lua perlin functions whose scale and offset are always set to 0 and 1.
0, 1 means the noise value has an average value of 0 and varies very roughly between -1 and 1, although depending on octaves and persistence the output can occasionally be as large as -2 to 2.

(offset, scale, spread (x y z), seeddiff, octaves, persistence)
... is the format for C++ perlin, the new lua perlin map functions and register ores.

(seeddiff, octaves, persistence, scale)
... is the format for the older lua perlin function, here 'scale' is actually the 'spread', these older functions dont have parameters for offset and scale, those are fixed at 0 and 1.
Last edited by paramat on Thu Oct 10, 2013 16:24, edited 1 time in total.
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by paramat » Thu Oct 10, 2013 16:32

Seed and Seeddiff
--------------------
A perlin function needs a 'seed', this is just any old random whole number that acts as a seed to 'grow' a particular noise pattern, same seed same noise pattern.

Seeddiff = seed difference.
Perlin functions that use 'seeddiff' instead of 'seed' are 'world dependant'.
The value used as a seed is worldseed + seeddiff.
Seeddiff creates perlin functions with different patterns but they also remain world dependant, meaning in different worlds you get different patterns but also in the same world you get the same pattern.

This is all 'as far as i know', the devs know much more about this than i do but may be too busy to explain.
Celeron55 and hmmmm and several others here are the authority on mapgen, i'm just a beginner with a basic programming ability and some good ideas :)
Last edited by paramat on Thu Oct 10, 2013 17:43, edited 1 time in total.
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by philipbenr » Thu Oct 10, 2013 23:27

jojoa1997 wrote:the mapgen king is here


XD sooo true. He's made a pretty nice magpen for Magpenv7
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by Casimir » Fri Oct 11, 2013 10:06

Started an article in the wiki.
http://wiki.minetest.net/Mapgen_settings
 

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by Neon » Fri Oct 11, 2013 23:08

[Thumbs up] Thanks Casimir
EDIT: Added further description to wiki page
Last edited by Neon on Fri Oct 11, 2013 23:25, edited 1 time in total.
 

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by vqrulane » Thu Oct 24, 2013 15:49

Can I make the map smoother and plain (but not flat)?
 

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by paramat » Thu Oct 24, 2013 17:25

Yes by adjusting the perlin noise parameters, which mapgen, v6, v7 or indev?
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by vqrulane » Fri Oct 25, 2013 12:42

paramat wrote:Yes by adjusting the perlin noise parameters, which mapgen, v6, v7 or indev?

I'd choose v6.
 

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by paramat » Fri Oct 25, 2013 22:00

Your phone or window isn't wide enough to display the code box. If it's a phone, try rotating it to landscape mode.
Code: Select all
# Offset, scale, (spread factor in x, y, z), seed offset, number of octaves, persistence
#mgv6_np_terrain_base = -4, 20, (250, 250, 250), 82341, 5, 0.6
#mgv6_np_terrain_higher = 20, 16, (500, 500, 500), 85039, 5, 0.6

Persistence is terrain 'roughness' so reduce it from 0.6 to 0.4 or lower. Same for other mapgens.
Last edited by paramat on Fri Oct 25, 2013 22:01, edited 1 time in total.
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by vqrulane » Sat Oct 26, 2013 09:37

Thank you very much, paramat! :3
 

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by paramat » Sat Oct 26, 2013 17:06

Forgot to clarify, reduce persistence of those 2 perlin noises only. Also you could reduce octaves by 1 or 2 in those 2 perlin noises, that will eliminate some fine detail and make mapgen slightly faster
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