What's Minetest still missing over Minecraft?

[gamergardencat]

F = G * m1 * m2 /r^2

There would need to be a way to determine how much things weigh. There would be easier to implement on a fresh vanilla. All the nodes like sand would need to be defined. Mass would need to be defined. If gravity were written into the engine then there would be a way to wrap the world around the center point. Such a thing could hinder generation since the world maybe not so infinite but that benefit would be easier to tweak and decustomised how you want your world to look all at once. Then againe would could also see cube shaped planets come into the picture. Just need a way to calculate what happens when a node moves from one side the the world to the other.

[rubenwardy]

Not how much they weigh, but what their mass is. That is quite simple. Make players 60 Kg. The second mass is the mass of the hotspot. (Set by lua)

[twoelk]

F = G * m1 * m2 /r^2
...

some time ago I had a little fun with that formula: Using Newton's formula for gravitation to calculate ones weight on other planets.
gasp, the first version is 12 years old?

[rubenwardy]

Weight vs Mass annoys me. It's always misused.

[gamergardencat]

Weight vs Mass annoys me. It's always misused.

My math teacher that worked in aeronautics (rockets,jets) things like that told me you can find the mass of something by weighing it. I don't have any problem with doing that personally.

[twoelk]

Weight vs Mass annoys me. It's always misused.

he, that may indeed be an issue but I have grown sort of tired on insisting on this detail when talking to most people. Most of them live on this earth and don't intend to leave it. When I explain it to them they usually question the need of having to complicate things that they have a simplistic everyday life model of firmly loged into their view of the world with just enough knowledge of physics to not trip over their legs, which is difficult enough.

that said, correct me if I made a mistake in the script.

[gamergardencat]

Weight vs Mass annoys me. It's always misused.

he, that may indeed be an issue but I have grown sort of tired on insisting on this detail when talking to most people. Most of them live on this earth and don't intend to leave it. When I explain it to them they usually question the need of having to complicate things that they have a simplistic everyday life model of firmly loged into their view of the world with just enough knowledge of physics to not trip over their legs, which is difficult enough.

that said, correct me if I made a mistake in the script.

You're smarter than everybody else, so good for you. There is a great many different variables that can be plugged into a game. Computers don't fully and accurately represent real world stuff such as physics. It can be made to seem like it does and is very helpful for computing trajectory of a something moving from one place to another but really that's not what Minetest is doing here. No one is ever going to look for a voxel game to to help them plant colonies on Mars. Besides, making the Minetest world into a 6 sided planet is one thing, making each satellite moon or planet would be another adventure all together I don't think the developer are ready for. But that would be neat to jump on a ship and go to a space station and experince weightlessness in Minetest.

[twoelk]

...
You're smarter than everybody else, so good for you.
...

I'd be building spaceships if I was ;-P
nah, just fascinated by stuff most regard useless for everyday life ... hmm there was a name for such people, now if I could only remember

[gamergardencat]

...
You're smarter than everybody else, so good for you.
...

I'd be building spaceships if I was ;-P
nah, just fascinated by stuff most regard useless for everyday life ... hmm there was a name for such people, now if I could only remember

+1 lol

[lotek]

A few notes, about my experience with minetest and minecraft. I played first a few month minetest with my kids & friends, now we moved to minecraft. Always own server with around 5 players.

In short, we're addicted to mobs and want great landscapes (bioms).

Reason why I prefer minecraft and not minetest...
* More dense survival / adventure stuff in general (you have to fight to stay alive, find shelter while on a longer journey, help each other out, ecetera)
* A lot of animals, monster and npcs (have your own chicken, pig, cow and horse farm)
* More landscape (bioms) per default (e.g. mountains with snows, rivers, ...)
* System created buildings like mine shafts, strongholds, towns, and etcetera

from my administration view:
* rcon (remote control) with android app
* better map creator (mapcrafter) under linux
* external 3d map editor (mcedit) under linux

With Minetest I had to use a lot of plugins, like moretrees, plantlife, pyramids, snow, landup, 3darmor, ufo, hunger, food, mobf, creatures, worldedit, etcetera.. and in the sum it was also good, but the whole atmosphere is with minecraft a bit better, IMHO ;-) I know it's not fair at all to compare minetest with a million dollar project - but this should show what minetest is missing = mobs in the core with a lot of AI and bioms!

Where I like Minetest more:
* Official supported API (minecraft: waiting since 2 years I guess, bukkit is dead, sponge not yet ready and now micosoft is in charge, good night)
* Open Source / License
* Owners :-)

What I just don't care or it’s not that important to me:
* Java vs. C/C++ (as long it works under Linux)
* Pricing (25$ is ok for a game)
* Creating own Plugins/Modifications
* Graphics / Textures
* Performance (as long it runs on a newer laptop with an i5 everything is fine)

bye
Marcel

[Evergreen]

With Minetest I had to use a lot of plugins, like moretrees, plantlife, pyramids, snow, landup, 3darmor, ufo, hunger, food, mobf, creatures, worldedit, etcetera..

The whole point of minetest is to ue a lot of mods. (they aren't called 'plugins')

[Don]

With great freedom comes great responsiblity!

I love the freedom you have with this game. The big issue is that people want to install and play. Maybe if the main page of minetest.net had a quick write up about how it is a basic game and most features such as animals, extra trees etc are added with mods. That way people don't expect to install and play. Could allso add something to the main menu of the game such as "To add more features click on the Mods tab".

[Esteban]

With great freedom comes great responsiblity!

I love the freedom you have with this game. The big issue is that people want to install and play. Maybe if the main page of minetest.net had a quick write up about how it is a basic game and most features such as animals, extra trees etc are added with mods. That way people don't expect to install and play. Could allso add something to the main menu of the game such as "To add more features click on the Mods tab".

Agree. This should help with people expectations. So you can have an idea, I found Minetest by looking up "games/clones of minecraft". However, unlike other people I checked the forums and discovered the game was meant to be modded. So when I played the first time, I wasn't disappointed in any way.

[Don]

Also, adding the website to the main menu would help people easily find the information. As easy as it is to google, I am sure that many will not google "minetest" but would click a link if it is provided.

[Sokomine]

With Minetest I had to use a lot of plugins, like moretrees, plantlife, pyramids, snow, landup, 3darmor, ufo, hunger, food, mobf, creatures, worldedit, etcetera.. and in the sum it was also good, but the whole atmosphere is with minecraft a bit better, IMHO ;-) I know it's not fair at all to compare minetest with a million dollar project - but this should show what minetest is missing = mobs in the core with a lot of AI and bioms!

That's right, Minetest wants to be modded so as to fit to your personal taste :-)

You're right that mobs and survival aspects are still not very convincing. People who seek that will most likely find more fun in Minecraft. Something that comes close to it is AdventureTest. Maybe you ought to give that a try if you havn't already.

[SAMIAMNOT]

You could just download a game with tons of creepy stuff and goodies too. Overcraft is packed with extra stuff that can creep you out. :) But I do understand wanting a better adventure mode. I'm still having issues with the Creatures mod, and even though my favorite hostile mob is the Vombie from Animals Modpack, the modpack slows down Minetest considerably. (plus the textures suck.)

[Don]

Maybe the answer is people post the best mod combinations. They could say "if you like this kind of game then these mods will work."
Then anyone wanting a certain type of game will simple use the mods thats posted instead of trying to find what they want, get frustrated cause mods are not easy to find and give up.
When I started playing minetest the hardest part was finding mods that I wanted. They were out there but I could not find them. Now that I have been involved in the community for a little while I can find things.
Another issue is that minetest is about freedom. Minetest gives us the tools and we have to build what we want. Many people do not understand that. They are not use to freedom and the responsibility that comes with it. They just want to play a game. Because of this people will got to the game that has less freedom because it is less work.
I would not want minetest to change though. I prefer the freedom.
I believe the best way to deal with it is education.

[MrNomNom111]

I think right now the immersion is pretty shallow.

Right in (unmodded), you just get a sense that it's not finished, and so immediately there's a negative reaction to it. From the rendering fog that never really goes out of sight, to the helvetica, to the flat torches, it doesn't seem as.....interactable....as MC.

It's the little things, really. The crunch of grass, that small thud whenever you hit a stone block. The environment reacts to you.

[Morn76]

From the rendering fog that never really goes out of sight,.

Hit "+" a few times to increase rendering distance and F3 to disable fog.

[Calinou]

From the rendering fog that never really goes out of sight,.

Hit "+" a few times to increase rendering distance and F3 to disable fog.

Disabling fog is exactly the kind of thing that makes the game look unfinished…

As for view distance, it is automatically adjusted by the game; the minimum value is very low to accomodate for slow machines like netbooks.

[leeminer]

Maybe the answer is people post the best mod combinations. They could say "if you like this kind of game then these mods will work."
Then anyone wanting a certain type of game will simple use the mods thats posted instead of trying to find what they want, get frustrated cause mods are not easy to find and give up.
When I started playing minetest the hardest part was finding mods that I wanted. They were out there but I could not find them. Now that I have been involved in the community for a little while I can find things.
Another issue is that minetest is about freedom. Minetest gives us the tools and we have to build what we want. Many people do not understand that. They are not use to freedom and the responsibility that comes with it. They just want to play a game. Because of this people will got to the game that has less freedom because it is less work.
I would not want minetest to change though. I prefer the freedom.
I believe the best way to deal with it is education.

I agree, it would be cool to be able to make a mod aka "game" and have it packaged as a separate distribution package. So you download the game and you don't have to tweak it at all. Currently, if I'm not mistaken, you have to download Minetest then download the "Game" then rename the game folder after extracting then put it in the game folder.... etc etc.


Take Carbone for example, have a download package that installs itself and puts a shortcut on your desktop. Easy! The modding is both the best advantage of minetest and its biggest weakness. A 7 year old kid may not be able to do all this stuff, and I'm not even talking about linux.

[lansney]

Hello to all, It's my first post here, but It's not my first time here however...

Since long times ago, I read lot of Forum post here, and i'm pretty agree on mainly something :

Firstly, It's really true that MineTest has the tools to Really be good even better than Minecraft : It's coded in C++, so btw it should be 10 x time faster than Java( I mean here all logical code) , with a really nice, simply and powerfull Lua Api, it could and should be a really pros against Minecraft,
More Over, the game is pretty lightweight, you just download it ( arround 20 Mo), it start in arround 3 seconds, and you can play in less than 1 min...

BUT, and it's here I would say: BUT ...

Like some guys said before, MineTest has some lack of something to really appreciate fully the game :

Firstly, In my opinion, It's a problem of Structure and centralization, let me explain myself : By that I mean, for example, a better organisation for this project, for example, 2 Categories of differents Developpers : either Core Engine Developer who's work on optimize and greatly improve the engine in itself, or Content Developer, I mean developers who work on a, like it was told before : "Vanilla" Minetest, to at the minimum get introduce new people really greatly to the game, I know that the game is Fully custom' (mod, texture-pack, and so on...) but i think and I'm not the only one , that, people are a little confused about the first time they open the game, yesterday, I convinced my friends to play Minetest, at the first time they look lost, and never get fun ( I let them explicitly do what they want), but when I just told them the TestPurBdCraft texture pack and the soccer mod ( to have fun :p ) they immediately see the potential of the game, and that is the problem ... Because, new players need to be at least entertaining with a good and structured Game environment like guys said before( that mean consistent texture on the Vanilla Game, and merge some usefull mod on it) BUT that doesnt mean players will be closed to Vanilla Game, of course not ! they will be free to select their game mode ( subgame ) in main menu, but like I said, Vanilla game MUST be the main entry point of new players... and after they get started, they can join server or do dwhat they want!!

Ok I think I said all that I want to said, I though about post this like 1 month ago, but I I decided to post now, because, I got the motivation to do it, and I see this game should have really good potential !!

Besides, i'm a officially [url]minetest.fr[/url] writter, and I writted a post about the incoming Update 0.4.11, (you can see it if you want ) and I will post another post about What is Minetest and how to get started?


PS : I'm sorry if i haven't a good grammar, it's because i'm not a English native !

Cya Mates !
Lansney

[Linuxdirk]

Maybe not visibly reloading distant blocks (“chunks” in Minecraft terminology) every few seconds would be a nice thing.

Having nodes permanently disappearing and reappearing all the time gets a little annoying.

[Don]

@Lansney - I will start with saying don't apoligize for your grammar. It is better to have you here with bad grammar than to not have you here at all. Welcome to the forums.
This is a topic that has been discussed a bit. As I understand it Minetest_game is mean to be vanilla to give the people the freedom to choose how they want the game to be. Soon subgames will be included. This will give players a good out of the box experience. One thing that might be nice ia a first run script that gives a pop up to give a brief tutorial of how to get started.
The way the mods can be downloaded straight from the menu is a huge bonus. Remember that minecraft has to be hacked by forge or similar. It is really easy to get mods. The hard part is figuring out which mods you want.
One of the big draw backs that I see is that Minetest is not as progressive. You can only go so far before it just becomes the same old game. There are mods that help with this but more work needs to be done. With minecraft you can keep advancing for a very long time thanks to enchantments and other things. If you could keep improving your player for a long time it would be a great help.

[lansney]

@Don Hello Don and thank you for your welcoming message !
Yea, it's like I said, Minetest should be good structured from the beginning, and having a base vanilla game to begin with.
Of course, the strenght of MT is the freedom of having a custom World ( better than Mincraft with forge) so thjat why I will try to put all my knowledge to this game because I trust on It!

[Calinou]

Firstly, It's really true that MineTest has the tools to Really be good even better than Minecraft : It's coded in C++, so btw it should be 10 x time faster than Java( I mean here all logical code)

On average, when well programmed, Java is only 10 % to 15 % slower than C++.

Jake2 (port of Quake 2 to Java: benchmarks)

[lansney]

obvisouly you're right, but it's the globally mind of most people, that change anything on my post above...

[MykieDoesStuff]

I say that the community had done such a great job on working together! We can build and edit our mods and bring it to full potential. There is one thing I would like to ask, is to have multiple world support. I am currently thinking and working on the space version of Minetest. With multiple world support I do wish to have "planets" and galaxies to explore. (I am inspired by Star Citizen :L )

[philipbenr]

Can there be connections between different worlds, Like the MC servers. (Hive I think and all the others) Sort of like a world nexus idea... Actually, this is probably more of a mod request, but still. Anyhow, would this be possible with just lua?

[Linuxdirk]

obvisouly you're right, but it's the globally mind of most people, that change anything on my post above...

Statistical data, benchmarks or what most people think isn’t important for me. I just can speak for myself, but Minecraft ran with 80-100 FPS with 16×16 textures in window mode and with 50-70 in fuillscreen (2560×1440 pixels).

Since Minetest uses vsync and I was not able to disable it for testing purposes I have constantly 60 FPS in window mode or fullscreen mode no matter if I use the 16×16 default textures or any of the available 512×512 texture packs. When testing 512×512 textures in Minecraft it ran with 1 to 2 frames for every 10 seconds … when not crashing.