Using Minecraft Features

[Linxx]

I wish that it was easier to find crafting recipies, like have a book of recipies in the inventory (separate from your inventory where you keep stuff, and you click on it and it shows all the crafting recipies) I know there is a mod, but it would be nice if it came as a default.
Crafting recipie for book:
P = paper
W = wood planks

W P W
W P W
W P W

what about having an empty book with the recipes already in but with no names? that would make the player to have unlock the names to see what it is

[0gb.us]

I think a better option than a craftable book would be an in-menu crafting guide. RealBadAngel has a great example of what that might look like. However, maybe the "g" key should open up the craft guide page. Of course, that would require engine work, so maybe not.

Then again, it might make it easier to implement that idea of "unlocking" the names via having actually crafted said items. It wouldn't really detract from the game in any way, but would give players one more thing to work toward.

[Jordach]

Umm, everybody here should sit down and chill. Minecrap features are pretty crap IMHO, quit complaining if PilzAdam adds something because down the line you will end up liking it. See Mese crystals issue a few months back.

[0gb.us]

Umm, everybody here should sit down and chill. Minecrap features are pretty crap IMHO, quit complaining if PilzAdam adds something because down the line you will end up liking it. See Mese crystals issue a few months back.

Quick question. Is there anyone who was actually opposed to mese crystals, but likes them now? I don't know anyone who was opposed, and isn't still at least disappointed. The apparent "mese crystals are okay now" is likely coming from the fact that most people wanted them, combined with the fact that they already went stable, so there was no longer a point for those that didn't want them to keep fighting. After all, it's too late at this point to undo mese crystals.

The exception being me, as my problem with them was the mese + stone == ore recipe. Once that was removed, I quit fighting. But it wasn't that I suddenly "saw the light that is mese crystals", it's that they actually fixed what was my issue with them.

Note, my issue here is that a cap is being imposed on our once-limitless lava. I don't really care if obsidian stays or goes, I just want our easy to use lava back. If obsidian is what's keeping us from our lava, then it is the enemy in my eyes. But if there is a way we can have both, that's just as well. To be clear, it's the cap on our lava that is the lame feature from Minecraft, not the obsidian.

[Dopium]

Who really cares if Minecrafters think Minetest is a copy, aslong as the game is fun to play is the way i see it. To be honest i actually dont really like that some want change minetest so much, that it wont even be anything like Minecraft. If the game goes in a completely different direction i will most likely switch to Minecraft. Like i have said before im sure many Minetest players were actually looking for a Minecraft type game and c++ preferred over java. Not saying anyone has to make it the same but once alot of the Minecraft features are pushed away id say alot of the community will move on. Back when i played Minetest 0.3 even the developers said it was a clone because they wanted it written in c++. So why did this outlook change.....

[Gambit]

Usually it's like this:

If Minetest doesn't have something Minecraft has, their argument is: "This game sucks, it can't even do the same things as Minecraft. If you're going to clone a game, at least try to copy everything."

If Minetest has the same features as Minecraft, their argument is: "Look, water flows just like in Minecraft. These people can't think of their own ideas? Why can't these developers be original?"

If Minetest has a feature that's better then what Minecraft has, their argument is: "Oh I guess that's pretty cool but who really needs this kind of feature? Developers are only making the game more complicated than it should."

That's the gist of arguments from Minecrafters. They're free to have their own opinion. I'll just leave it at that.


As for Mese Crystals, I really don't see much of a problem. I thinks it's the shard that is going just a little to far. I don't really understand the need of even smaller bits of Mese at all. I feel it just an extension of an already overpowered ore. Mese is going to needs a equally powerful ore to compete with it eventually.

[Mito551]

Says Minetest is a Minecraft clone.
Complains that Minetest doesn't have things Minecraft has.
Intelligence.

looks like a haiku :D

Usually it's like this:

If Minetest doesn't have something Minecraft has, their argument is: "This game sucks, it can't even do the same things as Minecraft. If you're going to clone a game, at least try to copy everything."

If Minetest has the same features as Minecraft, their argument is: "Look, water flows just like in Minecraft. These people can't think of their own ideas? Why can't these developers be original?"

That's where minetest developers have to be creative: implement minecraft features in a minetest-exclusive way.

If Minetest has a feature that's better then what Minecraft has, their argument is: "Oh I guess that's pretty cool but who really needs this kind of feature? Developers are only making the game more complicated than it should."

this argument is plain stupid. (i know it isn't yours, still)

[PilzAdam]

That's where minetest developers have to be creative: implement minecraft features in a minetest-exclusive way.

Thats a good idea. This is also what I tried with obsidian. The generation is same as in MC, but you can craft shards and cook glass out of them. This is something that MC doesnt have.

[nomohakon]

That's where minetest developers have to be creative: implement minecraft features in a minetest-exclusive way.

Thats a good idea. This is also what I tried with obsidian. The generation is same as in MC, but you can craft shards and cook glass out of them. This is something that MC doesnt have.

Not enough.

[Mito551]

That's where minetest developers have to be creative: implement minecraft features in a minetest-exclusive way.

Thats a good idea. This is also what I tried with obsidian. The generation is same as in MC, but you can craft shards and cook glass out of them. This is something that MC doesnt have.

Not enough.

[0gb.us]

That's where minetest developers have to be creative: implement minecraft features in a minetest-exclusive way.

Thats a good idea. This is also what I tried with obsidian. The generation is same as in MC, but you can craft shards and cook glass out of them. This is something that MC doesnt have.

Not enough.

Not enough? Maybe if we didn't make lava finite like in Minecraft, it would be different enough ...

[Mito551]

Thats a good idea. This is also what I tried with obsidian. The generation is same as in MC, but you can craft shards and cook glass out of them. This is something that MC doesnt have.

Not enough.

Not enough? Maybe if we didn't make lava finite like in Minecraft, it would be different enough ...

[tinoesroho]

I wish that it was easier to find crafting recipies, like have a book of recipies in the inventory (separate from your inventory where you keep stuff, and you click on it and it shows all the crafting recipies) I know there is a mod, but it would be nice if it came as a default.
Crafting recipie for book:
P = paper
W = wood planks

W P W
W P W
W P W

what about having an empty book with the recipes already in but with no names? that would make the player to have unlock the names to see what it is

+1

[onpon4]

Let me throw in my two cents:

I've never played Minecraft and never will because I refuse to use nonfree software (where "free" refers to freedom, not price). My brother has, and does, though. He first tried Minetest because he had heard from me that it is a clone of Minecraft and wanted to see how it is. Since he was downloading from Linux Mint's repos, he was playing 0.3.1, but he had a good experience; he expressed surprise that the game was actually a pretty decent clone. He introduced it to me, and we played it. We haven't played in a while, but as far as I can tell, his overall impression of the game so far is positive, and I think he would play it as often as Minecraft if his friends were playing it, too.

Point is, I really don't think Minetest needs to avoid being like Minecraft. In fact, I think being like Minecraft is an asset: it makes it easier for Minecraft players to jump right in, like my brother did. Sure, some people will complain that the game isn't "original", but people will complain either way, and of course, there's always mods.

Actually, maybe it's just me, but I think this game has an incredibly steep learning curve for someone who isn't familiar with Minecraft. I say this because, when I first saw the game, I was dumbfounded by the inventory screen; I only understood it when I played with my brother for the first time and he explained that the cube of 9 squares was used to "craft" things (from the appearance, I had assumed that it was mere inventory space), and he also helped with a lot of the recipes and the basic stuff you need to craft at first (I never would have guessed that you're supposed to get stones with a wooden pickaxe, or build a furnace by making a circle out of stones).

If Minetest is to become significantly different from Minecraft, it needs to have a way for people who aren't already familiar with it to easily pick it up, something that seems to be lacking at the moment. It needs that regardless, actually. A built-in crafting guide, a more clear inventory screen (clearly distinguishing the crafting grid from the inventory), and most importantly, a help screen with just the basics of how to start playing (visual, with minimal text) would go a long way in this direction.

[4aiman]

as far as I can tell, his overall impression of the game so far is positive, and I think he would play it as often as Minecraft if his friends were playing it, too.

There are a lot of that kind of people, even here many players came from MC. And I don't understand why we can't copy features from there. In Minetest almost all features are OPTIONAL presented in a form of mods. There are pretty much talks about minecraft lameness (I even was accused of hating MC O_o), but c'mon, minetest IS a clone in many ways. As a clone we CAN became more popular than minecraft. As a different game - not likely.
Why is that?
Well, amongst minecrafters (even those with positive attitude) minetest always will be only a clone. BUT! Manic digger or the likes of it are wa-ay far from both minetest AND minecraft. Minetest have so much attention amongst minecrafters because it IS similar. And all they (minecrafters) want before switching to minetest (I'm talking about adequate people who are able to see potential in minetest) or playing both of them is minecraft features they like and get used to. Lame or not - IT DOESN'T MATTER. If Minetest will take it's own path, anyone here should forget about Minecraft and it's features.
We have same craft recipes, we have redstone counterpart (overhauling one), we have farming and tries to make somee mobs but we don't wanna be minecraft clone? Ridiculous. Simple and plain. Copying AND creating new features is the way, copying AND probably changing crafts to more reasonable (for devices like those of buildcraft or IC2 (Hi there, RealBadAngel! You're doing great job!) is the way, copying AND overshadowing is the way. Not diverting.

It's pretty pointless to try to convince anyone that we should go a way of Internet Explorer. ("Wut?!!" is not an option, Mito ;)
Yes, IE. MS was copying Netscape Nevigator in every feature they could and when the time of IE 4.0 had came they (MS) were like a train ready to squash the Netscape.
IE is lame, sure. But at least 50% of users all over the world (much more, actually - lowered for those who probably would say I'm exaggerating) use IE! And IE 10 is really fast and neat (nope, I'm totally for Firefox, so that's no ads of IE or Win8).

Anyone can say that IE is a crap (and it is), but Minetest consists of mods which can be separated and installed/uninstalled independently. We (and by that I mean Minetest) need to became Firefox-like (in terms of "extensibility" ) and chase Minecraft, adding more it's features and more features that minecraft DO NOT HAVE. In fact we have plenty of what minecraft do not have, but we don't have some of it's features too. One can't just came and say that IE/Windows is crap and user should switch to another browser/OS. That's too hard for too many people.

In the end personally I see Minetest called a clone of minecraft, which have more features then latter, more fun to play and superior in everything except bugs. I didn't say "lameness", cause that's too subjective to be said. Everyone have their own thoughts about what is "lame".

All Minetest need is "configurability". Mods is the great way to do that. But we also need new callbacks for Lua, pathfinding and simple mobs AI in C++. I'm not bithcing about anything. But mobs are slow and stupid. And they will stay so, unless some basic AI would be coded in C++.

As for the renewable lava, obsidian and stuff like that... Those who want renewable lava should have an option in config. But I don't really care about it. Just remember, that first one want more lava and then he/she will ask to ban a griefer who use that easy-to-get lava. Obsidian being hard to crack is lame? Then make a substitute and call it whatever you like. Just remember, that calling it "obsidian" will be less lame then make a new ore as a substitute. In first case minecrafter will say: "Oh, MT is just a clone. Good one, possible, but a mere clone", while in the second one minecrafter will say: "OMG!!! They took our obsidian, called it a different name, drew some horrible textures, added some questionable crafts from it and spoiled in every way! Copy it PROPERLY if you do!!! God, it's like playing lame Minecraft...".
Anyone who will try to say, it's just my point of view, will be ignored, cause it's not - Minetesters want their lava back, Minecrafters want their nether and mobs and hunger-meter. Minetest is a community project atm. And community want both MC an MT features. Not all of us, not all the features, but we want.

I suggest a little experiment:
Calinou said he tried to make a game as close to MC as he can. PilzAdam have his Minitest game and there are other mods like snow etc. Also there are some unmerged minecraft-like features for the game engine.
So... Is there any who can and want to try build a geme engine + minetest_minecraft_game that will copy minecraft as much as it's possible atm? We create special topic, a youtube channel, social networks groups and see what happens and how many people will come to minetest and will help it to develop it and how many will come just to play.
Oh, if anyone want to mention blockplanet_old or other two-year-old-fork (despite blockplanet still have some features MT doesn't), then I'm talking about a fork with all minetest have atm and will have in the future.

If this will fail, then anyone who (like me) was for making MT closer to MC should shut up. I'll definitely will do that. Those who can understand no one needs smth will too (I'm pretty sure). Other non-adequate persons may treated as trolls then.

[Linxx]

this is all i have to say it's ok to be original i actually encourage it but from what i have seen from the game industry both open source and non open source (don't know how to call the othe rone) both indie and mainstream there's always and i do mean always a bit of copying in the games i just want to sugest this, try to take the good ideas from MC and make them your own with some personal touches that would fit into MT and take the really bad ideas as a learnign expirience maybe you will find the solution to theyr bad idea and implement it into the game or come up with a whole new idea and ofcourse bring out your own original ideas into the melting pot too isn't that what comunity is all about making a good soup of ideas and mixing it well for a new flavor :) hope this helps a bit

[jojoa1997]

Let me throw in my two cents:

I've never played Minecraft and never will because I refuse to use nonfree software (where "free" refers to freedom, not price). My brother has, and does, though. He first tried Minetest because he had heard from me that it is a clone of Minecraft and wanted to see how it is. Since he was downloading from Linux Mint's repos, he was playing 0.3.1, but he had a good experience; he expressed surprise that the game was actually a pretty decent clone. He introduced it to me, and we played it. We haven't played in a while, but as far as I can tell, his overall impression of the game so far is positive, and I think he would play it as often as Minecraft if his friends were playing it, too.

Point is, I really don't think Minetest needs to avoid being like Minecraft. In fact, I think being like Minecraft is an asset: it makes it easier for Minecraft players to jump right in, like my brother did. Sure, some people will complain that the game isn't "original", but people will complain either way, and of course, there's always mods.

Actually, maybe it's just me, but I think this game has an incredibly steep learning curve for someone who isn't familiar with Minecraft. I say this because, when I first saw the game, I was dumbfounded by the inventory screen; I only understood it when I played with my brother for the first time and he explained that the cube of 9 squares was used to "craft" things (from the appearance, I had assumed that it was mere inventory space), and he also helped with a lot of the recipes and the basic stuff you need to craft at first (I never would have guessed that you're supposed to get stones with a wooden pickaxe, or build a furnace by making a circle out of stones).

If Minetest is to become significantly different from Minecraft, it needs to have a way for people who aren't already familiar with it to easily pick it up, something that seems to be lacking at the moment. It needs that regardless, actually. A built-in crafting guide, a more clear inventory screen (clearly distinguishing the crafting grid from the inventory), and most importantly, a help screen with just the basics of how to start playing (visual, with minimal text) would go a long way in this direction.

i was discussing this in irc. They said no to adding a crafting guide that people could use. Why not give it on start-up. A crafting guide would get rid of the need to have a beginner level and also it would help with mods. People say use a mod(which i do) but i am asking for it to be added for the new players. Also using a book as a tool would help alot. Maybe get writing in books possible and give a begginers guide to players when they join the first time. Also it should be shutoff able with the config for experienced players.

[Evergreen]

Says Minetest is a Minecraft clone.
Complains that Minetest doesn't have things Minecraft has.
Intelligence.

+1

[jordan4ibanez]

Minecraft clone, complains about Minecraft features.

This post:

[mauvebic]

Meh, the way i see it, you got two groups of people vying for influence here: Those that have heard of and played Minecraft first, and those who heard of minetest first. Im in the latter. Being in the latter, i tend to look at features for their merits, without having any basis for comparison.

That being said, i've never been a fan of playing follow the leader, because you never get ahead that way. I'd rather we clean their chronometers and show them how it's really done, we'll know we're ahead when their players start complaining that MC is copying MT. But i know im in the minority on that :p

[jojoa1997]

They do. What is with horses we came up with that a long time ago. And from the peaks I have seen they look like this. http://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?pid=56889#p56889 . Also what is with the change in texture format. I am pretty sure minetest is Getting more popular with minecrafters. Why change after so long exactly when minetest is getting popular. They are using our open source ideas. Anyways we are finally turning into a game and I don't think notch wants his idea creator to be destroyed

[Melkor]

They do. What is with horses we came up with that a long time ago. And from the peaks I have seen they look like this. http://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?pid=56889#p56889 . Also what is with the change in texture format. I am pretty sure minetest is Getting more popular with minecrafters. Why change after so long exactly when minetest is getting popular. They are using our open source ideas. Anyways we are finally turning into a game and I don't think notch wants his idea creator to be destroyed

about that horse is from a mod from March 2012 in the minecraft forums, while the post in here is from 12 december 2012. minecraft developers take ideas from mods made by their comunity, aren't you being a little paranoid here?

[jojoa1997]

They do. What is with horses we came up with that a long time ago. And from the peaks I have seen they look like this. http://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?pid=56889#p56889 . Also what is with the change in texture format. I am pretty sure minetest is Getting more popular with minecrafters. Why change after so long exactly when minetest is getting popular. They are using our open source ideas. Anyways we are finally turning into a game and I don't think notch wants his idea creator to be destroyed

about that horse is from a mod from March 2012 in the minecraft forums, while the post in here is from 12 december 2012. minecraft developers take ideas from mods made by their comunity, aren't you being a little paranoid here?

I was doing one thing supporting mauvebic. Now that that has been brought to light we know the truth. In reality i dont care if we are known or not. I just care about making a good game that can bring in all aspects of other games and its own.

[Evergreen]

[h]Here are my two cents[/h]


I think that the "Minecraftrs'" opinions don't matter. The way I see it is that we can copy some things from Minecraft. How ever, I want Minetest to be unique too. If we take something from Minecraft, we should make something special about it. Like the obsidian; since obsidian in real life is not tough at all. However, in Minecraft it is. I think obsidian should be like it is in real life. Also, addressing the complaint of making the game too complex; make it configurable. That's what I love about the way mods work in Minetest. They are very easy to install and uninstall.



To conclude my opinion, if you want to add something from Minecraft, make something special about it.

[12Me21]

This is what I think:
Using things from minecraft just because they're in minecraft is stupid. Adding stuff from real life that just happens to be in minecraft is good.
For example:
- There is no extremely hard black material called obsidian in real life (obsidian is real, but it isn't very hard), It is only in minecraft, and now, unfortunately, minetest. Obsidian is a type of glass, and it should be about the hardness of rock.
- Diamonds are not blue, they are clear (usually) and they are not magically already cut when you mine them.

What happened to all the original ideas, like mese? and the realistic ideas, like, umm, uhh, I can't really think of any right now.

We also need to add more stuff to default minetest, like:

- mesecons
- a way to get dyes
- a way to get wool
- minecarts
- more biomes/more interesting terrain
- rivers
- mobs
- farming
- more foods than just apples

[jojoa1997]

we can get wool now with flowers

[tinoesroho]

Diamonds suck. They are plentiful in real life, and to tell the truth, overrated. You should at least require a bloody tool to "cut" the diamonds.

[jojoa1997]

Diamonds suck. They are plentiful in real life, and to tell the truth, overrated. You should at least require a bloody tool to "cut" the diamonds.

yeah the picking in mine craft is better.
Diamond,steel,gold-all
Stone-lapis,stone,iron ore
Wood - stone,coal

[Calinou]

picking in mine craft is better.
Diamond,steel,gold-all
Stone-lapis,stone,iron ore
Wood - stone,coal

In Minecraft, gold tools have the same restrictions as wooden tools. Also, steel tools cannot mine obsidian.

[onpon4]

Why complain about realism for... um, a game? Realism is rarely a good model for game mechanics.

So obsidian isn't so hard in real life. Well, we don't have Nyan cats in real life (except on video sharing sites), trees in real life don't float when you cut off part of the trunk, and real-life water and lava don't multiply like animals.